Thor
Posts:7
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| 03/31/2008 6:52 PM |
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Clipboard Buddy sits there capturing my clipboard contents. Then, after I delete the contents, it doesn't any longer. I close and restart it, and the same thing happens.
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support
CB Support
Posts:27
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| 04/01/2008 7:48 AM |
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Hi,
When this happens it's because of another program which requests access to the clipboard but when it closes, does not pass the correct information to Windows as to what program is next in the clipboard chain. Windows then pass the clipboard info to the now closed program but because it's closed it cannot pass the info to the next program, which is probably CB. It will take some investigative work on your part to find out what program is causing this, but it's usually not too hard to find. To help, turn beep on capture on so you can hear if clips are being recorded. Also, you can have Clipboard Buddy request to be put back into the chain without restarting the program by pressing ALT-J twice, (Once turns the clipboard capture off and the second time turns it back on). Overall it's not the best architecture as Windows depends on other programs to pass the clipboard data along to the next program in the lineup that has requested this info. If one of the programs does not pass the info along or doesn't let Windows know when it has closed and who was next in line then the whole clipboard chain collapses at that point. Hope this helps.
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Thor
Posts:7
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| 04/01/2008 7:55 AM |
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Thanks. Who'd have thought it was so clunky. I always assumed the clipboard was a separate buffer that held the content for all subsequent programs.
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support
CB Support
Posts:27
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| 04/01/2008 1:31 PM |
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There is another way you can create a clipboard program as you suggested with the buffer. It's more stable in getting clips from Windows as you can just check the Windows clipboard memory every second but this is very process intensive and slows your PC down as the clipboard program must work on a timer, usually checking every 500 milliseconds. Windows designed it with the 'request entry into chain' so programs wouldn't be constantly checking the Windows clipboard memory for new clips and could just pass the info on if they've requested to be told by Windows when there is a new item cut or copied to the clipboard. Problems happen though when programs aren't coded properly and the clipboard data is not passed to the next program in line.
Windows Clipboard Documentation - "Read only if your bored" 
Windows provides a method for applications to hook into the clipboard to receive notifications when its contents change. This is done by registering one of the application's windows to receive messages when the clipboard changes. These windows are known as clipboard viewers. Windows maintains a linked list of clipboard viewers – the clipboard chain. Each viewer window is responsible for passing on notifications to any window that follows it in the chain. Since Windows relies on the cooperation of viewer applications, a badly behaved application can bring down the whole notification system. It is therefore important to play by the rules. The viewer window should also be un-registered before the associated application terminates.
When the content of the clipboard changes, Windows notifies the first window in the chain by sending it a WM_DRAWCLIPBOARD message. This window is responsible for passing the message to the next registered viewer window, and so on down the list. Consequently it can be seen that each clipboard viewer needs to record the identity of the next window in the chain.
Windows also notifies the windows in the clipboard chain when clipboard viewers are removed from the list. This is done by passing a WM_CHANGECBCHAIN message to the first window in the chain. The parameters of WM_CHANGECBCHAIN identify the window being removed along with the window that follows it in the chain. The message is passed along the chain until the window preceding that being removed is found. That window then updates its record of the next window in the chain.
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Thor
Posts:7
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| 04/01/2008 10:49 PM |
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Doesn't seem to fit the theory. I turned sound on. CB quit recording when I copied a URL from Firefox.
1. Not the first URL I've copied. No problem with others
2. Tried again -- still no good. Trouble is, the "chain" was still active: I had no problem pasting the URL into Outlook Express.
This means that material is entering the clipboard, not being captured by Clipboard Buddy, but available to the next program that needs it.
Alt-J worked to restore capture. |
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support
CB Support
Posts:27
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| 04/02/2008 7:37 AM |
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Hi,
The last cut/copy data will always be available when you paste from Windows, that is not the chain. The chain starts after the first program registered with Windows as a clipboard viewer. Windows doesn't delete the clipped data after it's passed to the first viewer program registered so pasting it using Windows will always be available. Sometimes it's not apparent what program or window is breaking the chain, but one of them is. It could even be a Firefox add-on, toolbar app or system process which isn't easily viewed by the end user. I'm currently working on a free tool application that monitors what processes are running as clipboard viewers, what program follows each one and you should be visibly able to see where the chain is being broken by looking at the list as soon as CB doesn't receive the clipboard data any longer.
How the clipboard data is passed:
Windows > program A > program B > program C
If program B quits or closes without telling program A that program C is next in line then the clipboard chain gets broke. However, you will always be able to paste the last clip from Windows directly as it is not deleted until another clip is cut or copied.
Windows only lets the first viewer program registered know what data has just been copied to the clipboard. Windows depends on the first program to pass the data to the next in line and so on.
Like I said before it's not the best architecture but thats the way Windows has designed it.
Hope this explains it a bit more.
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Thor
Posts:7
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| 04/08/2008 3:07 PM |
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| The puzzle continues! Now, CB beeps when I save to the clipboard, but still doesn't record the selection. So CB "knows" I've made a selection, but doesn't scarf it up. Two alt-J's results in no more capture AND no more beeps. The only solution seems to be to re-start CB. |
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Thor
Posts:7
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| 04/08/2008 3:19 PM |
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A bit more information.
At the time I posted the above message, CB was showing only one saved clip. I exited the program and re-started it and -- glory be! -- there were all the saves I'd been looking for! CB was capturing them, but not displaying them.
Sorry to be a PITA, but this is potentially the most useful utility I have |
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Mark
CB Lead Developer
Posts:53
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| 04/10/2008 9:15 AM |
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| Thanks for the feedback Thor, it's always valuable. I'll definitely look into this and put a fix in with the next update of the program. |
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mmediaman3
Posts:3
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| 09/05/2008 10:17 AM |
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Hi Mark,
This issue is annoying me as well and I feel a little slighted after paying what your company asked for a product that works sometimes. I can't tell you how many times I have been copying stuff to the clipboard and just assuming that the stuff will be there when I need it, only to find out that it's not.
I don't know about others, but in our super productive work environments, it is not productive to constantly check CB2 to see if it is really getting clipboard content. I am not trying to whine, but I think that CB2 is extremely useful when it works and so I am pretty disappointed that I can't depend on it.
In addition to what Thor observed, I find that CB2 does not recover well when a laptop on which it is running has been restored from standby. These type functionalities should be technically feasible. I understand that there can be technical challenges, but surely they can be overcome. Please keep in mind that many users aren't concerned with the mechanics of which Windows modules pass what information to other modules... they just want it to work so they can remain productive.
I notice there has been no movement on product development and little activity on this forum. Again a little disappointing since I really believe this can be a very popular product for the workplace, given the right marketing and performance improvement.
Is this a serious project for you or just a hobby ? Is the project dead ?
okay I said enough... sorry for the rant.
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Thor
Posts:7
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| 09/05/2008 11:53 AM |
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All this detail about how material is passed to the clipboard has been fascinating. But it need not get in the way of what we want a program like CB to do.
Check out CLIPX at http://clipx.com. This program has been totally reliable for several months. It offers most of the functionality of CB. And it doesn't take up screen space, jump out at you when you accidentally bump it, etc. You can view the contents with a hot key.
I liked CB a lot, but it just got too frustrating.
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mmediaman3
Posts:3
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| 09/09/2008 5:38 PM |
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Thanks Thor... I think I prefer the docked panel of CB though over having to click something in the System Tray which it seems to be the way ClipXX works. I suppose I should explore the hotkey option. Funny how dead this CB forum is... not many people seem to use this utility.... It is so useful, I think people are just no familar. I wish Mr CB Support would do some more development to sure it up some more
Cheers |
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mmediaman3
Posts:3
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| 09/11/2008 6:33 AM |
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Hey Thor, I tried ClipXX and so far I like it. I think I can get past not having the screen dock feature and like you said, many times you bump the dock by mistake anyways which can be annoying. Plus ClipXX is free... so can't ask for much more if it is a stable app. Bye CB... hope the $80 or whatever I spent to license 2 of my machines is going to do you all some good.
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Thor
Posts:7
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| 09/11/2008 11:35 AM |
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ClipX has been very reliable for 5 months now. I can't honestly find any downside. I know you have discovered that it's as easy to click [windows]-v as it is to click ctrl-c or ctrl-v.
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